The Son of God Was Either God or a Bad Man? – Is Jesus God the Most High?

It is being claimed that the divinity of Christ is the central Christian doctrine, and that this doctrine is “like a skeleton key that opens all the others.” By divinity, the context makes it clear that the author means that Jesus is the Most High Yahweh. We do not deny the divinity of Jesus in that mightiness that the only Most High has given to Jesus. We do not, however, believe that the divinity, the mightiness, that the only Most High has given to Jesus means that Jesus is the Most High who has given to Jesus all authority and power. Indeed, rather than being a key that opens all other doctrines, this doctrine that Jesus is the Most High denigrates the role Jesus had in becoming a man. If Jesus was the Most High while in the days of his flesh, then rather than condemning sin in the flesh, Jesus justified sin in the flesh, since such an idea would have meant that for Adam to have obeyed the Most High, Adam would have needed to have been the Most High in the flesh. — Romans 8:3

See the studies:
How God’s Son Condemned Sin in the Flesh

Hebraic Usage of the Titles for “God”

Additionally, those who claim that Jesus is the Most High usually add to this that Jesus is still in the flesh, that Jesus will always be bound to his body of flesh for eternity. Such denies the very basis of the ransom sacrifice of Jesus as given in the Bible. It would mean that either Jesus fail to complete his sacrifice, or that he took back what he had offered for sin. Either way, such would annul the basis of the ransom sacrifice of Jesus.

See the studies:

Jesus Died a Human Being – Raised a Spirit Being
The Basis of Atonement

Jesus never claimed to the “God”, that is, Jesus never claimed to be the One whom he designated as the only true God.  Rather, Jesus claimed to have been sent by the only true God, the only true Might of the universe. (John 17:3) Jesus never once claimed to be the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, thus the idea that “Christ was either God or a Bad Man” is irrelevant. Indeed, if Jesus in the flesh was his God, then the whole basis of the redemption by means of his sacrifice becomes irrelevant. No, Jesus was not his God, but this does not at all make Jesus a “bad man”. Such an argument is simply sophistry.

It was a man — not God — who sinned and brought condemnation upon mankind. All that was needed to rectify the condition of sin was another man — not God — who would obey God. If that man had to be God in order obey God, then such would not condemn sin in the flesh. It would not proven that a righteous man could obey God perfectly. It would rather have proven that a righteous man would have to be God Himself in order to obey God.

The Bible nowhere says that for a man to be the offering for sin that such man would have to be his God. That idea comes, not from the Bible, but out of the imagination of men whose minds cannot fully submit the revealing of ths spirit as given through the Bible. By going beyond what is written, these men have submitted themselves to an idol of their own making (evidently aided by Satan) and wish make it a requirement of all that they must submit to their imaginations for salvation, thus displacing the salvation that is revealed by God’s holy spirit in the Bible.

See:

Jesus is not Yahweh (Jehovah)

The Bible reveals that what is needed for salvation is not God, but a man, one a little lower than the angels as was Adam. God Himself provided such a man through His son (not Himself), for he sent his son into the world of mankind in the flesh; God gave Jesus that flesh, that body (Hebrews 10:5), so that he — having become a man, nothing more, nothing less — was not under the condemnation through Adam. Unlike Adam, however, Jesus never once disobeyed the Most High; he proved his faithfulness and thus showed his Father to have been just, while providing the way for his Father to justify mankind. — John 6:51; Romans 3:26; 5:12-19; 8:3,19-21; 1 Corinthians 15:21,22; Hebrews 10:10.

All the abilities that Jesus had, he received from the only true God, all to the glory of the only true Most High. None of Jesus’ miracles or abilities that God gave to Jesus give us any reason to use the spirit of human imagination so as to assume and add to the scriptures that the Son of God is “God” of  whom he claimed to be the son. — Luke 1:32; 10:22; 3:35; Matthew 28:19; John 13:3; Acts 2:22,36; 3:13; 1 Corinthians 15:27;  Ephesians 1:20-22; Philippians 2:9-11; Hebrews 1:2.

John 1:51 does not describe Jesus as “God”, but as the son of the man (David), and “God” is depicted in that scripture as one person, totally and separately distinct from the son of David.

As far as repelling the attacks of those who claim that Jesus was a bad man, a liar, a lunatic, etc, such as agnostics, deists, Muslims and other non-Christian religions, one does not need to add to the scriptures that Jesus was the Most High in order to counter the claims of such. Indeed, adding such to scriptures diminishes the role of Jesus as having been obedient to the Most High, of the salvation provided through the offering of the body of Christ to the Most High.

Jesus is not the God Most High; no scripture ever presents Jesus as being Yahweh, the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, although many read such a thought into many scriptures.

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9 responses to “The Son of God Was Either God or a Bad Man? – Is Jesus God the Most High?

  1. Y’shua The Messiah, The Son of The ONE and Only True Living GOD, Father(Creator) of ALL…….

    It is so, so be it!

    The 1st Day of Creation:

    “The earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep, and the Spirit of GOD moved upon the face of the waters.” (Gen 1:2)

    Then GOD spoke HIS Word into being…….

    “Let there be Light”!

    And “There was Light”…….(Gen 1:3)

    And such ‘Light’ was to be, and is, Eternal!

    So it is that Hope is Alive!

    Even though this wicked world begins and ends it’s day in darkness it is good to realize that the 1st Day of Creation, although begun midst the darkness, ended in ‘Light’! (Gen 1:5)

    And such ‘Light’ was not the sun, moon or stars for they were not created until the 4th Day. (Gen 1:14-19)

    GOD’s Word “Let there be Light” became “The Light which enlightens every man born into the world” and was “the glory The Messiah had with Our Father before the world began”…….(John 1:9, 17:5)

    LIGHT Begot Light…….

    LIKE Begot Like…….

    The Messiah, “The Light of the world”…….(Jn8:12)

    The Messiah, “The beginning of The Creation of GOD”…….(Rev1:1, 3:14)

    The Messiah, “The Son of The Living GOD”…….(John 6:69)

    And Our Father, HE “created all things by(of, in and thru) The Messiah”…….(Ep3:9)

    The 1st Day of Creation.

    “And GOD called The Light, Day, and the darkness HE called night. And the evening(darkness) and The Morning(Light) was The 1st Day.” (Gen 1:5)

    Now if the beginning can not be ‘seen’ nor understood, then what of the end?

    Confusion would reign! And today confusion does reign midst the religious systems of this world, for apart from “The Light” there is only darkness, “the blind leading the blind” ;-(

    And the Apostle Paul saw “The Light” that is The Messiah on the road to Damascus:

    “At midday, O king, I saw in the way a Light from Heaven, which was above the brightness of the sun, shining round about me and them which journeyed with me.

    And when we had all fallen to the earth, I heard a voice speaking unto me, and saying in the Hebrew tongue, Saul, Saul, why do you persecute Me? It is hard for you to kick against the goads.

    And I said, Who are you, Master? And The Messiah said, I am Y’shua(for He spoke in the Hebrew tongue) Whom you are persecuting”. (Acts 26:13-15)

    GOD’s Word “Let there be Light” became “The Light which enlightens every man born into the world”, “The Light” that is The Messiah, and was “the glory The Messiah had with Our Father before the world began”…….(John 1:9, 17:5)

    Peace, in spite of the dis-ease(no-peace) that is of this world and it’s systems of religion “for the WHOLE(not just a portion) world is under the control of the evil one”, indeed and Truth…….(1John 5:19)

    Truth IS, a lie never was and is not…….

    Abide in Truth…….

  2. francis,

    Thanks for your reply; however I disagree that the Logos is part — the light of Genesis 1 — of the world that was made through the Logos, which is basically as self-contradiction.

    See my study on this at:
    http://godandson.reslight.net/archives/1436.html

  3. Would be good for you to free yourself from pagan catholic/christian folklore.

    The following may help you break the chains of strong delusion that hold you captive ;-(
    ——-
    Someone had commented, “I am interested in how you synchronize your doctrine on GOD creating The Light with John’s version”.

    i believe you are referring to John 1:1-5 and how John’s testimony bears witness to The Messiah being “The Light” begotten by Our Father the 1st Day of Creation.

    Father Help! and HE does…….

    (John 1:1) “In the beginning was The Word, and The Word was with GOD, and The Word was GOD.”
    ——-
    “In the beginning was The Word”

    The 1st Day of Creation was the beginning.

    And “In the beginning” GOD(Creator) WAS, and HE spoke The(HIS)Word “Let There Be Light” and “There was Light”!

    “and The Word was with GOD”

    GOD spoke The(HIS)Word “Let There Be Light” and The(HIS)Word “Let There Be Light” became “Light” and “was with GOD”, HE WHO IS LIGHT!

    “and The Word was GOD”

    GOD spoke The(HIS)Word “Let There Be Light”, “The(HIS)Word was GOD” and became Light!

    LIGHT Begot Light!

    The Messiah, “The True Light(The Light of Truth) which enlightens every man born into this world.”(John 1:9)

    The Messiah, “The beginning of The Creation of GOD(Our Father)!”(Rev3:14)

    So it is that The Messiah, the first begotten of Our Father, testified “The Father is Greater than I.”(John 14:28)

    “The Light”, “the glory The Messiah had with Our Father before the world began.”(John 17:5)
    ——-
    (John 1:2-5) “The same was in the beginning with GOD. All things were made by Him, and without Him was not any thing made that was made. In Him was Life; and The Life was The Light of men. And The Light(The Messiah)shinned midst the darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.”

    “To make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning (as in John 1:2) of the world has been hid in GOD, WHO Created all things by The Messiah(The(GOD’S)Word “Let There Be Light”).”(Eph 3:9)

    Our Father(Creator)created “all things” of, by, in and thru The Messiah(The(GOD’S)Word “Let There Be Light”).
    ——-
    (John 1:14) “And The(GOD’S)Word(“Let There Be Light”) was made flesh, and dwelt among us, and we beheld His(The Messiah) glory, the glory as of the only begotten of The Father, full of Grace and Truth.”

    “The Light” was “the glory The Messiah had with Our Father before the world began.”(John 17:5)

    And finally it was as The Messiah testified, “He answered and said unto him, “if a man loves Me, he will keep My Words, and My Father will love him, and WE will come unto him, and make our abode with him. He that does not love Me does not keep My sayings, and The Word which you hear is not Mine, but is The Word of The Father WHO sent Me.”” (John 14:23-24)

    Father Help! and HE does…….

    So there is Hope!

    For Miracles do happen…….

    Hope is there would be those who experience The Miracle that is receiving “the love of The Truth” for they will “see” The Light that is The Messiah…….

    Peace, in spite of the dis-ease(no-peace) that is of this wicked world. for “the WHOLE(not just a portion) world is under the control of the evil one” indeed and Truth…….(1John5:19)

    Truth IS, a lie never was and is not…….

    Abide in Truth…….

  4. francis:

    Regarding John 1:1-5 and the light of that was created as spoken of in Genesis 1:3. The “light” of Genesis 1:3 is part of the world that was made through the Logos. (John 1:3,10) The Logos was not made through the Logos.

    See the studies:
    Light, Darkness and the Logos

    In the Beginning

    What Beginning?

    The Six Days of Creation

    Jesus’ Prehuman Glory == The glory of John 1:14 was not the glory that Jesus had with his God before he became flesh. While in the days of his flesh, Jesus did not have his prehuman glory, else why would be be asking for that glory in John 17:5? Jesus did have, when he became flesh, the glory that God had given to him as a human being, a glory that is a little lower than the angels. — Hebrews 2:9.

    Yes, the whole world is not of the new creation, and is under the control of Satan. Jesus never was, and never will be part of the world into which he came; likewise, the sons of God, the new creatures in Christ, are not part of the world that became corrupted through lust.

  5. The only thing about God speaking the word into existence, is that it would have to pre-exist day 1 of creation, for it is said that Christ who is the logos of the Father assisted the Father in the creation of the universe.

  6. Pingback: Romans 8:3 – How God’s Son Condemned Sin in the Flesh « Focus on the Atonement

  7. Pingback: Hebraic Usage of the Titles for “God” - Jesus and His God

  8. Pingback: Romans 8:3 – How God’s Son Condemned Sin in the Flesh - Focus on the Atonement

  9. Pingback: Romans 8:3 – How God’s Son Condemned Sin in the Flesh : Restoration of All Things

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