Category Archives: Savior

The Son of God Was Either God or a Bad Man? – Is Jesus God the Most High?

It is being claimed that the divinity of Christ is the central Christian doctrine, and that this doctrine is “like a skeleton key that opens all the others.” By divinity, the context makes it clear that the author means that Jesus is the Most High Yahweh. We do not deny the divinity of Jesus in that mightiness that the only Most High has given to Jesus. We do not, however, believe that the divinity, the mightiness, that the only Most High has given to Jesus means that Jesus is the Most High who has given to Jesus all authority and power. Indeed, rather than being a key that opens all other doctrines, this doctrine that Jesus is the Most High denigrates the role Jesus had in becoming a man. If Jesus was the Most High while in the days of his flesh, then rather than condemning sin in the flesh, Jesus justified sin in the flesh, since such an idea would have meant that for Adam to have obeyed the Most High, Adam would have needed to have been the Most High in the flesh. — Romans 8:3

See the studies:
How God’s Son Condemned Sin in the Flesh

Hebraic Usage of the Titles for “God”

Additionally, those who claim that Jesus is the Most High usually add to this that Jesus is still in the flesh, that Jesus will always be bound to his body of flesh for eternity. Such denies the very basis of the ransom sacrifice of Jesus as given in the Bible. It would mean that either Jesus fail to complete his sacrifice, or that he took back what he had offered for sin. Either way, such would annul the basis of the ransom sacrifice of Jesus.

See the studies:

Jesus Died a Human Being – Raised a Spirit Being
The Basis of Atonement

Jesus never claimed to the “God”, that is, Jesus never claimed to be the One whom he designated as the only true God.  Rather, Jesus claimed to have been sent by the only true God, the only true Might of the universe. (John 17:3) Jesus never once claimed to be the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, thus the idea that “Christ was either God or a Bad Man” is irrelevant. Indeed, if Jesus in the flesh was his God, then the whole basis of the redemption by means of his sacrifice becomes irrelevant. No, Jesus was not his God, but this does not at all make Jesus a “bad man”. Such an argument is simply sophistry.

It was a man — not God — who sinned and brought condemnation upon mankind. All that was needed to rectify the condition of sin was another man — not God — who would obey God. If that man had to be God in order obey God, then such would not condemn sin in the flesh. It would not proven that a righteous man could obey God perfectly. It would rather have proven that a righteous man would have to be God Himself in order to obey God.

The Bible nowhere says that for a man to be the offering for sin that such man would have to be his God. That idea comes, not from the Bible, but out of the imagination of men whose minds cannot fully submit the revealing of ths spirit as given through the Bible. By going beyond what is written, these men have submitted themselves to an idol of their own making (evidently aided by Satan) and wish make it a requirement of all that they must submit to their imaginations for salvation, thus displacing the salvation that is revealed by God’s holy spirit in the Bible.

See:

Jesus is not Yahweh (Jehovah)

The Bible reveals that what is needed for salvation is not God, but a man, one a little lower than the angels as was Adam. God Himself provided such a man through His son (not Himself), for he sent his son into the world of mankind in the flesh; God gave Jesus that flesh, that body (Hebrews 10:5), so that he — having become a man, nothing more, nothing less — was not under the condemnation through Adam. Unlike Adam, however, Jesus never once disobeyed the Most High; he proved his faithfulness and thus showed his Father to have been just, while providing the way for his Father to justify mankind. — John 6:51; Romans 3:26; 5:12-19; 8:3,19-21; 1 Corinthians 15:21,22; Hebrews 10:10.

All the abilities that Jesus had, he received from the only true God, all to the glory of the only true Most High. None of Jesus’ miracles or abilities that God gave to Jesus give us any reason to use the spirit of human imagination so as to assume and add to the scriptures that the Son of God is “God” of  whom he claimed to be the son. — Luke 1:32; 10:22; 3:35; Matthew 28:19; John 13:3; Acts 2:22,36; 3:13; 1 Corinthians 15:27;  Ephesians 1:20-22; Philippians 2:9-11; Hebrews 1:2.

John 1:51 does not describe Jesus as “God”, but as the son of the man (David), and “God” is depicted in that scripture as one person, totally and separately distinct from the son of David.

As far as repelling the attacks of those who claim that Jesus was a bad man, a liar, a lunatic, etc, such as agnostics, deists, Muslims and other non-Christian religions, one does not need to add to the scriptures that Jesus was the Most High in order to counter the claims of such. Indeed, adding such to scriptures diminishes the role of Jesus as having been obedient to the Most High, of the salvation provided through the offering of the body of Christ to the Most High.

Jesus is not the God Most High; no scripture ever presents Jesus as being Yahweh, the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, although many read such a thought into many scriptures.

2 Corinthians 13:14 – Trinity?

The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Spirit, be with you all. Amen. – 2 Corinthians 13:14, World English

This scripture is often presented by trinitarians as a though the scripture presents the Son of Yahweh as part of a triune God. In actuality, we find nothing in the scripture about three persons, all of whom are supposed to be the one true God.

That which is being prayed to with the Corinthian Christians is “Grace”, “love”, and “communion”, respectively of Jesus, God, and the holy spirit. “Grace” is not a person, nor is “love” a person, nor is “communion” a person.

Nevertheless, in order to see “trinity” in the verse, one has to imagine and assume that the triune God is not represented by the word “God”, but rather that only one of the alleged persons of “God” is represented by the word “God”, and then one has to imagine and assume that “the Lord Jesus Christ, is another person of, not the unipersonal “God” who is being spoken of in the verse, but rather the triune “God” who is being imagined, assumed and added to the verse. Then one has to do the same imaginings and assumptions, concerning the unipersonal God’s holy spirit, and add what they have imagined and assumed to the verse. Thus, not based on what the verse actually says, but rather what is being imagined and assumed upon the verse, the verse is then, by means of the circular reasoning employed, presented as proof of the triune God.

The reality is Paul never once presents the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob as more than one person. Instead, Paul presents the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob uniperonsonally as “The God and Father of the Lord Jesus Christ.” (2 Corinthians 11:31, World English) Any idea of a triune God does have to be imagined, assumed, added to, and read into, what Paul wrote in 2 Corinthians 13:14, or what any Bible writer wrote anywhere in the Bible.

One could say that there is a trinity in the sense that the only true God, the son of the only true God, and the holy spirit of the only true God, are one in agreement (1 John 5:8), but the trinitarian dogma of three persons in the one God cannot be found in this verse, or anywhere else in the Bible, except by means of what has to be imagined using the great spirit of human imagination, using that imagination to form assumptions into dogma, which dogma has to be added to, and read into any scripture to which the trinitarian dogma might be applied, including 2 Corinthians 13:14.

http://godandson.reslight.net/archives/1055.html

Of course, in doing so, the trinitarian dogma, by insisting that Jesus is still a man, strips and denigrates the purpose of Jesus’ coming into the world of mankind, of his obedience to the only true God which resulted in condemning sin in the flesh, and of the atoning sacrifice of his flesh, since, according to trinitarian dogma, Jesus still is flesh, a human being, etc., and thus, this is why such false teaching can be a hinderance to appreciably understanding the beauty of the ransom sacrifice that Jesus gave. — John 6:51; 12:47,48; 1 Timothy 1:15; 1 John 2:2; 4:2,3,10,14; 2 John 1:7; Hebrews 10:10; 1 Peter 3:18.

http://atonement.reslight.net/

Finally, the fact that “God” is presented as one person in 1 Corinthians 13:14, and that Paul does this throughout his letter when he uses the God to speak of the God of Israel, the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, shows that Jesus is not being presented a person of a triune God.

For more related the trinity, see:

Jesus and His God

The Son of Yahweh is Not Yahweh

In response to:

http://how2becomeachristian.wordpress.com/2008/10/08/u-dont-believe-jesus-is-god/

Yes, we still do not believe that Jesus is Yahweh, the only true God. Nothing on the page gives any reason to think that Jesus is Yahweh, of whom he is the Son.

I am presenting the scriptures below that are used on the page. If the scripture has a link or links, all you need to is to click on the link(s) related to that scripture.  At present, not all scriptures have any link attached. Many scriptures provide links with Google searches which may or may not, at present, have a link that discusses the scripture from standpoint presented; if pertinent discussion should be added at a later date, then the search should include that discussion once it has been added.

1. Scriptures being used to claim that Jesus is Omniscient, evidently with the idea that such an attribute would mean that Jesus is his God, Yahweh.

Some general links:

https://sonofyah.wordpress.com/2008/10/05/gspt2/

Matthew 12:25
http://notrinity.blogspot.com/2008/10/mat12-25.html

Matthew 27:18
https://sonofyah.wordpress.com/2008/10/10/mat27-18/

Luke 6:8
See the Comments for Matthew 12:25
http://notrinity.blogspot.com/2008/10/mat12-25.html

John 2:24-25
http://notrinity.blogspot.com/2008/10/john2-24.html

John 21:17
http://reslight.net/forum/index.php?topic=272.0

Revelation 2:23
https://sonofyah.wordpress.com/2008/12/27/rev2-23/

The son of Yahweh, of course, does not know all that his God and Father knows.  (Mark 13:32; Revelation 1:1) Many trinitarians claim that only the “human being” does not know what God the Father knows, but that Jesus the God Being is supposed to allegedly not be the same sentient being as the human being, but rather an omniscient being. In effect, this actually makes Jesus into two separate and distinct persons, one who has only the sentiency of a human being who does not have the omniscient sentiency, and another who has the sentiency of the omniscient being.

2. Scriptures Presented to Allegedly Prove that Jesus is Omnipotent, evidently to supposedly prove this means that Jesus is the Most High.

Ephesians 3:20
https://sonofyah.wordpress.com/2008/12/30/eph3-20/

Philippians 3:20,21
https://sonofyah.wordpress.com/2008/12/30/phil3-20/

Colossians 2:10
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Colossians+2%3A10%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Hebrews 1:3
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Hebrews+1%3A3%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Revelation 1:8
http://godandson.reslight.net/rev-1-8.html
http://reslight.net/forum/index.php?topic=139.0
https://sonofyah.wordpress.com/2008/09/18/ao-01/

The truth is as revealed by God in the Bible: Jesus is son of the only Most High, Yahweh. Jesus is never spoken of as the “Most High”; he is not the only Most High Yahweh of whom he is the son. — Genesis 14:22; Psalm 7:17; 83:18; 92:1; Luke 1:32; John 13:16.

3. We are next presented with scriptures that are intended to show that Jesus Christ is unchangingimmutable

Hebrews 1:8-12
http://godandson.reslight.net/heb-1-10.html

Hebrews 13:8
http://notrinity.blogspot.com/2008/09/hebrews-138.html

4. It is next claimed that Jesus, the Son of the Most High, is present everywhere – omnipresent.

Matthew 18:20
http://notrinity.blogspot.com/2008/10/mat1820.html

Romans 8:10
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Romans+8%3A10%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

1 Corinthians 10:4
https://www.google.com/search?q=%221+Corinthians+10%3A4%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Revelation 2:1
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Revelation+2%3A1%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Revelation 3:20
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Revelation+3%3A20%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

5. The next set of scriptures are supposed to prove that Jesus has eternal existence, evidently meaning that Jesus has always existed and will always exist.

Isaiah 9:6
http://reslight.net/forum/index.php?topic=181.0
https://sonofyah.wordpress.com/2008/09/08/isaiah-967/
http://notrinity.blogspot.com/2008/07/isaiah-96.html
http://godandson.reslight.net/isaiah9-6.html

John 1:1-3
http://creation.reslight.net/tb.html
http://godandson.reslight.net/john-1.html

John 8:58
http://godandson.reslight.net/i-am.html
http://reslight.net/forum/index.php?topic=304.0
https://sonofyah.wordpress.com/2008/10/12/john8-58/

Revelation 1:8
http://godandson.reslight.net/rev-1-8.html

6. Scriptures are presented to allegedly prove the claim that the Son of Yahweh is the Creator, and thus Yahweh whom he is the Son.

Is Jesus the Creator?
http://reslight.net/forum/index.php?topic=167.0

Genesis 1:26
http://godandson.reslight.net/gen-1-26.html
http://reslight.net/forum/index.php?topic=196.0

John 1:2-3
http://creation.reslight.net/tb.html
http://reslight.net/forum/index.php?topic=95.0

John 1:10
Evidently thought to support the idea that Jesus is Creator because the scripture, as it reads in many translations, says that the world into which the Logos came was made “by” the Logos. The word “by” is rendered from the Greek dia, which is being used here in the sense of an agent being used by another. The word is better rendered as “through” rather than by, as many translation do:  “He was in the world, and the world was made through him, and the world didn’t recognize him.” (World English) See also:
http://reslight.net/forum/index.php?topic=167.0
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22John+1%3A10%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

1 Corinthians 8:6
https://www.google.com/search?q=%221+Corinthians+8%3A6%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Colossians 1:16,17
http://godandson.reslight.net/colossians1-16.html
http://reslight.net/forum/index.php?topic=108.0

Hebrews 1:2,3
http://godandson.reslight.net/heb-1-1-10.html

Hebrews 2:10
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Hebrews+2%3A10%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Hebrews 3:3-4
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Hebrews+3%3A3%22&sitesearch=reslight.net
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Hebrews+3%3A4%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

7. The next set of scriptures gives scriptures that show that Jesus is the judge of all mankind, evidently with the idea that this would mean that the Son of Yahweh is Yahweh.

Jesus is made judge of all by the only Most High, Yahweh. The fact that Jesus is made judge actually shows that Jesus is not the Most High.

Matthew 7:22-23
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Matthew+7%3A22%22&sitesearch=reslight.net
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Matthew+7%3A23%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Matthew 25:31-33, 41
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Matthew+25%3A31%22&sitesearch=reslight.net
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Matthew+25%3A32%22&sitesearch=reslight.net
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Matthew+25%3A41%22&sitesearch=reslight.net
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Matthew+25%3A41%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

John 12:48
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22John+12%3A48%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Acts 10:42
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Acts+10%3A42%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Acts 17:31
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Acts+17%3A31%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Romans 2:16
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Romans+2%3A16%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Romans 14:10-12
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Romans+14%3A10%22&sitesearch=reslight.net
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Romans+14%3A11%22&sitesearch=reslight.net
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Romans+14%3A12%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

2 Corinthians 5:10

https://www.google.com/search?q=%222+Corinthians+5%3A16%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

2 Timothy 4:1, 8
https://www.google.com/search?q=%222+Timothy+4%3A1%22&sitesearch=reslight.net
https://www.google.com/search?q=%222+Timothy+4%3A8%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Hebrews 10:30
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Hebrews+10%3A30%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

We are next presented some scriptures regarding God’s holy spirit

Matthew 3:11
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Matthew+3%3A11%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

John 15:26
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22John+15%3A26%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Romans 8:9
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Romans+8%3A9%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Galatians 4:6
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Galatians+4%3A6%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Revelation 5:6
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Revelation+5%3A6%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

We are next presented with scriptures that are supposed to allegedly prove that Jesus is worshiped as the God of Jesus.

Jesus was never worshiped as the Most High; this is discussed in the following studies:

Jesus Received Worship

The Worship Due Jesus

Luke 4:8
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Luke+4%3A8%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Revelation 22:8-9
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Revelation+22%3A8%22&sitesearch=reslight.net
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Revelation+22%3A9%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Acts 10:25-26
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Acts+10%3A25%22&sitesearch=reslight.net
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Acts+10%3A26%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Matthew 2:1-2
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Matthew+2%3A1%22&sitesearch=reslight.net
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Matthew+2%3A2%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Luke  24:51-52
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Luke+24%3A51%22&sitesearch=reslight.net
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Luke+24%3A52%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Matthew 2:10-11
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Matthew+2%3A10%22&sitesearch=reslight.net
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Matthew+2%3A11%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Matthew 8:2

Matthew 9:18

Matthew 14:33

Matthew 15:25

Matthew 28:9

Mark 5:6

Luke 24:51-52

John 9:35-38

Hebrews 1:6

Revelation 5:8-14

Revelation 15:3-4

We are given a scripture with with the statement that Jesus is the object of saving faith

John 14:1-6

We are next given a series of sets of scriptures that are supposed to show the Son of Yahweh’s “Essential Deity”

For our discussions on the word “deity” and usage in the Bible,  see:
http://tinyurl.com/rl-deity

1. Scriptures where the Son of God is supposed to show the Son of Yahweh’s “Essential Deity”

Matthew 11:27
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Matthew+11%3A27%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Matthew 14:26, 33-33
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Matthew+14%3A26%22&sitesearch=reslight.net
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Matthew+14%3A33%22&sitesearch=reslight.net
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Matthew+14%3A34%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Matthew 16:16
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Matthew+16%3A16%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Matthew 26:63-65
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Matthew+26%3A63%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

2. The following are scriptures that are alleged to prove that Jesus’ being called “Lord” is proof that he is his God.

See the studies:
“Lord” in the New Testament

Luke 2:11
http://godandson.reslight.net/?p=2615

Luke 3:4-6
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Luke+3%3A4%22&sitesearch=reslight.net
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Luke+3%3A5%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

1 Corinthians 12:3
https://www.google.com/search?q=%221+Corinthians+12%3A3%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Philippians 2:11
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Philippians+2%3A11%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Of course, in reality, the fact that Yahweh sent and anointed Jesus (Isaiah 61:1), and made Jesus “Lord” (Acts 2:36), does not mean that Jesus is Yahweh.
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Isaiah+61%3A1%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Acts+2%3A36%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

We are next given a series of scriptures from the Old Testament and New Testament that supposedly “point to Jesus Christ as being God.”


From the Old Testament:

Isaiah 7:14
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Isaiah+7%3A14%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Isaiah 9:6

Jeremiah 23:5-6

Micah 5:2

Malachi 3:1-2

Psalm 45:1, 6-7

Psalm 110:1-3
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Psalm+110%3A1%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Scriptures From the New Testament

Matthew 1:23
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Matthew+1%3A23%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

John 1:1-3, 14

John 1:18
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22John+1%3A18%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

John 20:27-28

Romans 9:5

Philippians 2:5-8

Colossians 1:15-16
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Colossians+1%3A15%22&sitesearch=reslight.net
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Colossians+1%3A16%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Colossians 2:8-10

1 Timothy 1:16-17

1 Timothy 2:3-4
https://www.google.com/search?q=%221+Timothy+2%3A3%22&sitesearch=reslight.net
https://www.google.com/search?q=%221+Timothy+2%3A4%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

1 Timothy 3:16

1 Timothy 6:14-16
https://www.google.com/search?q=%221+Timothy+6%3A14%22&sitesearch=reslight.net
https://www.google.com/search?q=%221+Timothy+6%3A15%22&sitesearch=reslight.net
https://www.google.com/search?q=%221+Timothy+6%3A16%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Titus 1:3
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Titus+1%3A3%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Titus 2:10
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Titus+2%3A10%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Titus 2:13

Hebrews 1:1-3
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Hebrews+1%3A1%22&sitesearch=reslight.net
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Hebrews+1%3A2%22&sitesearch=reslight.net
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Hebrews+1%3A3%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

Hebrews 1:8

Jude 25
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22Jude+1%3A25%22&sitesearch=reslight.net

We are next presented with scriptures where it is alleged that the Son of Yahweh claimed his own divinity.

Please note that we do not deny the divinity of Christ, but we do deny that the Son of Yahweh ever claimed to be his God.

Revelation 21:6-7

John 8:57-59

John 5:17-26

John 10:28-39

Mark 2:5-11

Not Yet Completed….